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View Full Version : Long, but honest read about Dem earmarks



lefthater
07-20-2007, 11:44 PM
Democratic earmark reforms lasted 100 days. When Democrats took control of Congress months back, incoming House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., bragged it would take her party less than 100 hours to curb wasteful pork spending by requiring members to attach their names to their "earmarks," exposing such waste to the harsh light of public scrutiny.

She failed to mention this "reform" would remain in effect for little more than 100 days.

At this point, "Democrats are sidestepping rules approved their first day in power in January to clearly identify 'earmarks' -- lawmakers' requests for specific projects and contracts for their states -- in documents that accompany spending bills," The Associated Press reported Monday.

"Rather than including specific pet projects, grants and contracts in legislation as it is being written, Democrats are following an order by the House Appropriations Committee chairman to keep the bills free of such earmarks until it is too late for critics to effectively challenge them," The AP continued.


Rep. David Obey, D-Wis., now says those requests for billions of dollars to finance home-district dams, bridges and research contracts won't be added to spending measures till the fall, when House and Senate negotiators assemble final bills to send to the president. But that means few lawmakers will get a chance to oppose specific projects.

Rep. Obey insists he's taking the step "reluctantly" because his Appropriations Committee hasn't had time to fully review the 36,000 earmark requests that have come flooding in -- despite all the Democrats' talk of "reform."

But predictably, watchdog groups who "scrub" appropriations bills for questionable provisions are outraged.

"What that does is leave out the public's input," objects Tom Schatz, president of Citizens Against Government Waste.

"This is not more sunlight," agrees Rep. Jeff Flake, R-Ariz. "This is actually keeping earmarks secret until it's too late to do anything about it."

The House-Senate compromise bills cannot be amended when they come up for final action in September, at which point they're subject to only one hour of debate, precluding challenges.

Meantime, Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., chuckled and accepted congratulatory handshakes on May 22 after his fellow Democrats banded together to permanently table (219-189) an official reprimand of the Pennsylvania Democrat for violating his party's own four-month-old rule barring "revenge killing" of other members' earmarks.

The whole point of the Democratic "reform" was to allow other members to criticize and oppose pork set-asides. But last month, when Rep. Murtha (the second-ranking Democrat on the Appropriations Committee, a man so powerful that he secured more than $200 million for his personal pet projects in 2006 alone, according to Taxpayers for Common Sense) sponsored an earmark to authorize $23 million for the National Drug Intelligence Center -- a government agency that happens to be based in his district -- Rep. Mike Rogers, R-Mich., a former FBI agent, had the nerve to rise and propose the allocation be canceled.

Rep. Rogers was acting in accordance with the Bush administration's desire to close the office, which duplicates services provided by the FBI and which has received repeated low marks from several federal review boards.

Rep. Rogers' attempt to cut the $23 million failed. Despite that, on May 17 an outraged Rep. Murtha -- who in his failed bid for majority leader described the ethics package in a private meeting with lawmakers as "total crap" -- approached Rep. Rogers on the House floor.

"I hope you don't have any earmarks in the defense appropriation bill because they are gone, and you will not get any earmarks now and forever," the now-tabled resolution quotes Rep. Murtha as telling Rep. Rogers.

Rep. Murtha has never disputed Rep. Rogers' account. He doesn't have to. He knows he will never be disciplined for violating Ms. Pelosi's reforms, because he had it right the first time. The "anti-earmark reforms" are just for show. Mere window dressing. Why, if we enjoyed the immunities of a colorful old Democratic congressman, we might even call them "total crap."

husker
07-21-2007, 12:56 AM
nothing will change unless Bush veto's everything until all the earmarks are removed. maybe he will do it, now that it isn't his party that is doing it.

BearDown
07-21-2007, 03:25 PM
Both parties spend money on stupid shit. That's what gets me pisst off. They spend my money any way they see fit if I like it or not. I want to gamble online they tell me I can't because they are not getting their cut. I want to go and buy some pot. I can't (:red: ) because they are not getting their cut. Unlike Tobacco and Alcohol, people would be growing the shit in there backyard if they did make it legal. I think that is one reason why they will not make it legal. Do you know how much money is wasted on the war on drugs every year? And that war was started by the Republican god known as Ronnie Reagan. We lost great gambling sites like Pinnalce because of (R)Tenn. Bill Frist. That is the main reason I don't like the Republican party. They are always telling you how it's going to be by playing the MORAL card, and what it really comes down to is that they are not getting their cut from it.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 06:21 PM
Beardown. This thread was about earmarks, not drugs or gambling. The Dems ran and won on a platform of NO EARMARKS. Then they get in office and change their tune and no one says anything? I am waiting for a lefty to come back with "well the Republicans were doing the same." And I agree. But they didn't lie to people like the left and say they were going to change everything.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 06:23 PM
:gives:

Spark
07-21-2007, 07:06 PM
:gives:

ditto

lefthater
07-21-2007, 07:19 PM
:gives:
You're not concerned where your tax dollars go? Spark too?

jordanrules23
07-21-2007, 07:36 PM
Waynes from Kerry country..

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 07:46 PM
Waynes from Kerry country..

I could care less about any party.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 07:46 PM
You're not concerned where your tax dollars go? Spark too?

No :gives:

lefthater
07-21-2007, 07:48 PM
No :gives:
Apathy is a cancer in the US.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:02 PM
Apathy is a cancer in the US.

:gives:

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:07 PM
:gives:
Sad. I feel sorry for people like you.

jordanrules23
07-21-2007, 08:09 PM
Sad. I feel sorry for people like you.
Lefthater, wayne is mostly a conservative...no need to say that

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:11 PM
Sad. I feel sorry for people like you.

Don't, my life is much better without stressing about politics 24/7

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:11 PM
Lefthater, wayne is mostly a conservative...no need to say that
Well I do feel sorry for someone who writes "who gives a fuck" when asked about goverment spending and shows apathy towards making things better. I didn't write that I felt sorry for him b/c he's "right" or "left".

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:12 PM
Well I do feel sorry for someone who writes "who gives a fuck" when asked about goverment spending and shows apathy towards making things better. I didn't write that I felt sorry for him b/c he's "right" or "left".

I wrote nothing. I clicked on a smiley face that sums it up.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:12 PM
Don't, my life is much better without stressing about politics 24/7
Stress and open-minded discussions are different things. And unfortunately, politics affects everything.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:14 PM
I wrote nothing. I clicked on a smiley face that sums it up.
And my opinion stands that apathy is a cancer and it's sad that people have that attitude.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:14 PM
Stress and open-minded discussions are different things. And unfortunately, politics affects everything.

I'm very open minded. That's why i say :gives: to those who are so NOT open minded and blinded by one side or the other. They all lie and they all suck.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:15 PM
And my opinion stands that apathy is a cancer and it's sad that people have that attitude.

Alot of things in this world are sad. Look around from New Orleans (Still) to Iraq.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:17 PM
I'm very open minded. That's why i say :gives: to those who are so NOT open minded and blinded by one side or the other. They all lie and they all suck.
Maybe I misunderstood your response of ":gives: " when I asked you about goverment spending. It sounded to me like you don't really care.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:18 PM
Alot of things in this world are sad. Look around from New Orleans (Still) to Iraq.
Agree 100%; which is why the correct leaders need to be in place to address these wrongs.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:21 PM
Agree 100%; which is why the correct leaders need to be in place to address these wrongs.

When you find the "Correct" leader let me know. As far as i can see, none are running.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:22 PM
When you find the "Correct" leader let me know. As far as i can see, none are running.
Unfortunately, I think it will ALWAYS be the "lesser of two evils" choice.

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:25 PM
Unfortunately, I think it will ALWAYS be the "lesser of two evils" choice.

That's my point, if they are two "Evils" ... Why the fuck should you talk up one or down the other. You are supporting the Evils either way and wasting time doing it.

TwoTonTony
07-21-2007, 08:38 PM
i think the avergae guy feels apathy because he feels he does not matter and that the people that supposedly represent them cow-tow to special interest groups before anything..

dubai controlling our ports

this immigration bill they are trying to shove down our throats

** i think all of us care, but we feel powerless in this system

America has become a laughing stock in many regards....we have turned into a fat and soft society where dodgeball is outlawed in schools because it effects the way kids think of themselves.....Life lessons have to be learned sooner than later......

I know this has nothing to do with politics but these are the future constituents being appealed to

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:42 PM
That's my point, if they are two "Evils" ... Why the fuck should you talk up one or down the other. You are supporting the Evils either way and wasting time doing it.
Well I disagree with your "wasting time" comment. And I apparently differ from you in that I am willing to play the cards dealt then to fold all the time. And I attempt to support the "lesser eveil" then bury my head in the sand and hope/wish/pray things become better.
If you are from Mass, you wouldn't question a state gov't budget of 22 billion dollars that in turn somehow spent 40 billion?

wayne1218
07-21-2007, 08:45 PM
Well I disagree with your "wasting time" comment. And I apparently differ from you in that I am willing to play the cards dealt then to fold all the time. And I attempt to support the "lesser eveil" then bury my head in the sand and hope/wish/pray things become better.
If you are from Mass, you wouldn't question a state gov't budget of 22 billion dollars that in turn somehow spent 40 billion?

I'm not from or in Mass. and if not supporting either evil means my head is buried in the sand than so be it. You should feel sorry for yourself. Anyone with the word hater in their name directed straight at 1/2 the country ought to learn a few things themself before riding around on their high horse.

lefthater
07-21-2007, 08:48 PM
i think the avergae guy feels apathy because he feels he does not matter and that the people that supposedly represent them cow-tow to special interest groups before anything..

dubai controlling our ports

this immigration bill they are trying to shove down our throats

** i think all of us care, but we feel powerless in this system

America has become a laughing stock in many regards....we have turned into a fat and soft society where dodgeball is outlawed in schools because it effects the way kids think of themselves.....Life lessons have to be learned sooner than later......

I know this has nothing to do with politics but these are the future constituents being appealed to

Agree with what you say except to add that if no one puts light on subjects, or attempts a reasonable discussion, then what happens? Are we just to "go with the flow" b/c something is broken?
I think the Dubai deal was a media out of control as NEVER was the security at the port to be turned over. That was, and always will be, the duty of the Coast Guard. With that said, most Americans wouldn't have wanted the deal to go through just based soley on "appearance."
Do you think if campaign finance reform was in place that special interest groups will yield less power?
Do you think if earmarks, (which was the original point of the thread) were stopped (as the Dems promised) or worse case, published well BEFORE votes are cast, that special interest groups would yield less power?

TwoTonTony
07-21-2007, 08:56 PM
Agree with what you say except to add that if no one puts light on subjects, or attempts a reasonable discussion, then what happens? Are we just to "go with the flow" b/c something is broken?
I think the Dubai deal was a media out of control as NEVER was the security at the port to be turned over. That was, and always will be, the duty of the Coast Guard. With that said, most Americans wouldn't have wanted the deal to go through just based soley on "appearance."
Do you think if campaign finance reform was in place that special interest groups will yield less power?
Do you think if earmarks, (which was the original point of the thread) were stopped (as the Dems promised) or worse case, published well BEFORE votes are cast, that special interest groups would yield less power?


dubai deal did not go through because of the backlash from citizens calling their sentaors and congressman.....

i think the immigration reform grassroots rebellion also was similar.....Until the politicians feel the wrath of their constituents they will cater to special interest groups....

as far as the other questions....i do not get involved in politics because i do not know who is telling the truth and to me it is like pissing in a fan....

do i care? yes......

however my priorities are running my business (65-75 hrs per week)
and taking care of my family
staying healthy

I prioritize in order of what affects my future the most and what i have "direct control" over...

These political debates are mere pissing matches and the more someone makes a pt. the more the other side digs their heels in....

too much party line politics for me.....I prefer to concentrate on issues and not parties....